? for people w/ air susp. on early '50s cars...

[133]

what type of setup are you running in the rear? are you still using the leafs or did you switch to a 4-link, etc, etc? i would like to use Air Ride's Shockwaves, but have no clue whether to get their leafspring kit or their 4-link. any input and help is greatly appreciated. thanks.

[Kulturepimp]

In my opinion, shockwaves suck, All the ones I have installed have leaked up till last year, I don't know that they have fixed the problem yet. You can just go with a 2600 bag on top of the axle with leafs.

Email me if you want some more info or particulars.

Thom

[Curt Six]

So What has done quite a few of these swaps, and his advice to me on the rear 'bag suspension for my '49 Ford was to go with '67-'72 Chevy truck trailing arms (easy to install, improve the ride over the leaf springs, work well with bags). I got the arms and will be doing the swap in the next month or so, so I'll let you know how it goes.
Curt

[junk runner jr]

I dont have an opinion on the shockwaves but I can say dont go with the Ir over leaf setup. I have it in one of my cars and it just does not have the load capacity to do the job on a heavy car. I am in the process of switching over to a four link and bigger bags.

[drgnwgn289]

I have the over leaf set up on my wagon and I don't have any problems with it. I've towed trailors and cars and I've had the back loaded with just about everything I own and it worked just fine. If you don't want to change the configuration of the rear suspension, this is a good way to go. If you don't mind puting in trailing arms, that is a better way to go.

[53choptop]

How much travel will the over the leaf systems give you? Which brands have you used? I am looking at Airlift. Any problems with that setup? I have read several airlift sites where it specifically states, this set up will not raise of lower the vehicle, it only for ride stability etc.

[Machinos]

I was browsing Air Ride's site last week and they have a really cheap over-leaf kit where you just take out a leaf or two and make up the difference with the bags. I have NO idea how it works, but it sounds good.

[nailhead60]

Ive got the bags over chevy trailing arms and havent had any problems with the suspension , except for the front I need to split the air valves and upgrade the sway bar for cornering , the car gets too much front roll in the big hills !

[drgnwgn289]

The over the leaf set up will give you as much travel as the springs, shackles and driveshaft allow as long as its set up right. On mine, I took out all but 3 main leaves and one overload. That way, when all the air is out of the bags, the car sits down on the bumpstops. Then I got the longest tapered rolling (sleeve type) airbag firestone made. You compress the bag to minimum hieght and build your brackets from there. That ensures that you get the most travel possible. On mine I've got damn near 10 inches of lift from 0 psi to 80 psi. You just have to make sure that when its all the way up, it isn't pulling the bag apart. You can use limitting straps attached to the ends of the shocks for this. You also have to make sure that when all the air is out, that the rear end hits the bump stops before the two ends of the bag hit each other.

[53choptop]

got any pics?

[nailhead60]

I like the idea of putting the limiting straps on , there must be some type of stop so when you lift the car the bag cant over extend ! I am using shocks measured to stop before the bag can pop

[drLovely]

If I were to muse the leaf spring setup in the rear, what would be the "economic"(cheap) way to do the front?

1954 Canadian Pontiac.

THX

[cool57]

[ QUOTE ]
So What has done quite a few of these swaps, and his advice to me on the rear 'bag suspension for my '49 Ford was to go with '67-'72 Chevy truck trailing arms (easy to install, improve the ride over the leaf springs, work well with bags). I got the arms and will be doing the swap in the next month or so, so I'll let you know how it goes.
Curt

[/ QUOTE ]This would make a good tech article!

[FONZI]

I have the death defying 2 link setup on my 51 chev coupe. Works good.


FONZI

[drgnwgn289]

The price of the set up on the front totally depends on the tools you have and the ammount of work you are willing to do yourself....I did all the work on mine except the powder coating and all I had in it was the cost of bags, fittings and lines (I already had the compressor, switches and solenoids).
The way I did it, I built a mount for the top of the bag that fit in the spring pocket and set the top flush with the bottom of the frame. Then, I cut out the control arm and welded in a piece that would mount to the bottom of the bag and lower the front at the same time. The most important thing is that the bags don't rub! Then you have to make an exterior shock mount and you're set, I'll see if I can get some pictures up later

[Thirdyfivepickup]

[ QUOTE ]
I have the death defying 2 link setup on my 51 chev coupe. Works good.


[/ QUOTE ]

2 Link... thats great!! http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Chris50 has the Air Ride kit designed for the rear of his 50 Ford. Went in fine. Has a big ole 'C' notch in the frame and missing a couple of leafs. It'll be a few months (God willin) before he road tests it...

...and hopefully he will do a tech post on the shockwave setup he made for the front... pretty trick!

[gege]

how about the front of the ala cart ? phony maybe but it had bags !

[JamesG]

I have air over leaf on the ass end of my wagon and it aint low enough! You also MUST have a swaybar back there or your tires if they are wide like mine will scrub your fender lip in a turn from body lean. Something that will help body lean is to run your sytem with 4 seperate controls. Mine is front and bach, meaning the front is one sytem and the rear is another sytem, the problem is when you take a corner and the body leans all of the air will rush to the side with less weight and that causes you to loose support on that side of the car........

[drgnwgn289]

I have the 4 way set up on mine and I don't have a problem with tire rub, however I don't have big wheels or really wide tires

[JamesG]

My wheels in the back are eight's and they are too wide even with the lip roll some. I wont have a problem when I go to seven with some traditional rims.......

[53_210]

My Chev has the air over leaf with bags meant for the front in the back. The bumpstops are cut out and the frame sits on the axle when the car is down. The springs are the three main leafs dearched. I drive it with 4 or 5 psi in the bags and that's enough to raise it a few inches.

Derrick

[JamesG]

Yea I'm down to just two leafs and I have a set of 4 inch blocks too. I run about 35psi....no bumpstops either.

A word to the wise, if you can afford it, go with a 4 link, if not........you'll be doing it all over like I'm going to do in the near future.

[nailhead60]

Ive had my axle shortened to avoid any rub on corners and the panyard bar takes care of the rest ( or has so far anyway ) The front was a piece of cake compared to doing the rear , But I was switching out the whole assembly from a closed drive line

[junk runner jr]

[ QUOTE ]
I have the over leaf set up on my wagon and I don't have any problems with it. I've towed trailors and cars and I've had the back loaded with just about everything I own and it worked just fine. If you don't want to change the configuration of the rear suspension, this is a good way to go. If you don't mind puting in trailing arms, that is a better way to go.

[/ QUOTE ]

sounds to me like you have a bigger bag inplace than I do. with nothing more than a load of four adults in mine I have problems with bottoming out. I am in the process of changing over to a four link setup with the larger tapered bag placed behind the axel. I also have excessive axel wrap since I am running only the main leaf and the helper. When accelerating with a load in the drive shaf comes up and rubs the crossmember.

[FONZI]

I have a step notch in the back with your standard double convoluted bags, 2 link w/panhard bar. Been running for like 3yrs. Have had very few problems. It sits right and rides right. It dosen't jump or anything but I can get in almost ANY driveway with no problemos.

I do not see any beefit to runnin shockwaves in the back. However, if and when i do the front of mine I will consdier them.

Oh, and my bag set up was designed and installed By Kevin Francis at KA Customs in Huntingotn Beach. He does GREAT work. I will try and post sum pics of some of his other stuff. His 41 Plynmouth is going to be incredible.

FONZI

[133]

[ QUOTE ]
Oh, and my bag set up was designed and installed By Kevin Francis at KA Customs in Huntingotn Beach. He does GREAT work. I will try and post sum pics of some of his other stuff. His 41 Plynmouth is going to be incredible.

FONZI

[/ QUOTE ]

i've seen him at the Long Beach swap meet. i've looked though his albums of photos and the cars look great. i mean, kickass. how's his welding skills? i mean, the guy that bagged my Ranger couldn't weld for shit, so this is a real concern for me. you can PM with more info. thanks a lot.

[FnDIRTYGREASER]

Whats the going rate to have the rear bagged, 2 linked, c-notched in socal?? just curious?

[1LOWCHIEF]

the going rate for ANYTHING in So-Cal is fucking outrageous, except for a blowjob: but that still runs ya about 50 to 80 bucks.. Err uhhh heh Just kidding!!!

Im curious too about these prices, Way back when (way back, like 7 or 8 year ago) a local shop wanted to charge me almost a grand for just a C notch in my mini truck!!

[FnDIRTYGREASER]

maybe a HAMBer does air suspension jobs on the side??

[cool57]

[ QUOTE ]
maybe a HAMBer does air suspension jobs on the side??

[/ QUOTE ]Kustombuilder....but he's far from CA

[oldandkrusty]

I've got bags and leafs on the rear of my "48 Caddy convert and I really like them but, it isn't really low enough because I didn't notch the frame AND raise the tunnel!! Also, if you do decide to keep your leafs, make sure that the leafs you do keep are in generally good condition. I kept the worn out springs on mine as I thought the bags would serve to replace the spring activity. Well they do when bouncing up and down but, I forgot to factor in spring wrap under acceleration. The worn leaf springs really wrapped up badly and there is nothing the bags can do to stop it. I wound up adding a homemade traction bar to the main leaf such as you used to see on the old super-stocker drag cars from the sixties. It works but is kind of hokey. If my lazy ass can get going this spring, I'm going to replace the whole shooting match with a four bar/bag setup. Do it right the first time always occurs to me after I've done it wrong!!! DOH!

[Roothawg]

[ QUOTE ]
Ive got the bags over chevy trailing arms and havent had any problems with the suspension , except for the front I need to split the air valves and upgrade the sway bar for cornering , the car gets too much front roll in the big hills !

[/ QUOTE ] I thought Kansas was flat.......

[FnDIRTYGREASER]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
maybe a HAMBer does air suspension jobs on the side??

[/ QUOTE ]Kustombuilder....but he's far from CA

[/ QUOTE ]

i wonder how much he charges?? just to get an idea. hope he stumbles unto this thread..

[nailhead60]

It is !! but there are some good off ramps

[McPhail]

Me and the 52 went for years with the bags on top of the axle, with only 3 posies leafs...... they were good for awhile, but they did wear in a couple of years and start to have the wrap up problems......double convoluted bags and leafs were almost too much, the ride was stiff and rode like a buckboard wagon.....all that movement also helped to wear out a ring and pinion on the old 57 Chevy rear axle too....... I have since had the car switched to a triangulated four link, a new 9", and sleeved bags.....we are still working out problems with the shock mounting locations, and I think the bag load capacity is a bit weak for my car, but overall the ride is 200% better and I have no sway through corners like I used to. I am now of the opinion that bags don't mix with leafs, unless it's a very minor lift involved, like one you'd get with airshocks.....My car was done for the first time years ago and there wasn't much road testing done on these systems, so we invented our own. So I know from road experience, to get low, you have to C the frame, four link it and lose the leafs....... only way to go........

[mercury Bill]

On my 49 merc, I left the leaf springs and made a bracket that bolts to the leaf springs just in front of the axle and another one that I welded to the frame. the car will drop the lake pipes to the ground.It raises about 6". Oh yea I removed three leaves. I have no axle wrap problems, no problems towing a trailer. The car runs consistant 13's in the 1/4

[FnDIRTYGREASER]

damn!! good stuff mercury.

[Wicked Death Chop]

earlier in the post, someone mentioned using 67-72 truck trailing arms. i just went down the block and crawled under a neighbors 69 pickup to check those trailing arms out..... and they are really long!! does anyone have a pic of these installed on a bagged anything? i would be interested to see that. do you cut them down?

thanks
jeff

[kustomd]

was the truck a long wheel base? because my daily driver 66 chevy truck has the same set up and they don't look that long. But I would be interested in seeing them in a car. Anyone used ladder bars for they're bags? I know a guy with a dodge dakota that has ladder bars on his and the bags on top of the axle. He's always smoking them down in that truck and he never has had a wrap problem or anything.

[Rocket88]

Here's the rear on my 49 Olds.
Long trailing arms just like a Chev truck, came from the factory like that!
I used 255c bags in the rear, I've got 8" of travel from bottom to the top.

http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/6/web/558000-558999/558132_3_full.jpg

[Noname38]

[ QUOTE ]
Here's the rear on my 49 Olds.
Long trailing arms just like a Chev truck, came from the factory like that!
I used 255c bags in the rear, I've got 8" of travel from bottom to the top.

http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/6/web/558000-558999/558132_3_full.jpg

[/ QUOTE ]


Hey rocket thanks for them pics yah sent. I'm comin along on the olds. Next step is swappin rears n bags. I'll try postin pics for everyone to see after the bags. Thanks again for the pics you sent. I might bug yah again for some measurements on yer rig so I can see just how simular the frames might be

[Dat Dirty Rat]

I really dont care for bags,,alot of friends of mine who run them seem to have nothing but problems. Just take your time when installing what ever kit you chose and make sure nothing will rub/puncture the bags. Most important of all in my opinion is to run hardlines. It may take a little longer but well worth it. The plastic lines are not reliable cause they can be pinched or even come off. The hardlines will not only be worry free but also give you a nice detailed look..I'm no pro at these kits and only given you my advice..Goodluck and please keep us posted. Every little bit of learning counts..Dirty

[Baumi]

59-64 Chevy Passenger rear suspension in a 56 Chevy (http://www.jalopyjournal.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB1&Number=351675&Forum=U BB1&Words=poor%20mans%204link&Match=Entire%20Phras e&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=345101&S earch=true#Post351675)
Not really early 50ies but maybe different.I´m running a 62 Chevy rear setup in my bagged 56. It´s still a lot of work to do, but it seems to work well.

[sawzall]

sorry no pic right now, but on the 67 - 72 chevy trucks.. reguardless of the length of the bed they all have the same length trailing arm.. I am using the chevy truck trailing arm under my 40 ford. I fabricated a new crossmember for the rear trailing arms just behind the frames x member.. sowhat, johnny longhair, motormikey, glasshole, and MAYBE even onelow48 all are using this same or similar setup..

IT WORKS..

on my 40 I have the bags mounted to the stock coil spring locations that the chevy truck trailing arms provided. they bags sit in front of the rear axle and therefore create MORE LIFT than air springs placed on top or behind the axle..

I liked the rear setup so much on my 40 ford that when I built my 48 ford pickup i built the entire frame on a 72 chevy shortbed chassis.. again swapped bags infront of the rear axle..


currently I am working on a 48 olds wagon.. I have a setup IDENTICAL to the setup that rocket has shown.. interestingly rocket your 49 olds frame looks ALOT like my 48 olds model 66 frame..wish I would have known that sooner....

good luck with your car.. what are you building anyway??

[robber grin]

Nice rear end...
looks like a cool set up too.

Reminds me a bit of my 62 C10. 60-66 C10's and 20's run those trailing arms too. They are being repopped now as well. I know LMC has them... @$100 each.

It would appear your set-up utilizes two panhard bars for centering... like the "newer" Caprices, etc.
Mine has the one long bar. I welded a threaded adjustment onto the end of my bar and it helps me with the lowered alignment.